I don't blame the US admin for being upset. We put a lot of credibility on the line to give Israel a chance to take the b*stards out.

I am sick over this.

Olmert is the Jimmy Carter of Israel.

Olmert must be related to John Murtha.

Hezbollah is to great of power and I quake in Syria's shadow.

Pray we live tomorrow,
Olmert

Judith, you keep changing your mind. One day he is Kerry, the next Carter.

All I can say is a thinking and acting like a lawyer in the midst of a war is a terrible approach to take. So he strikes me as more of a Clinton than a Kerry.

And no, the point that the US Admin is mad at Israel is not supposed to be a criticism of the Admin, but to explain that they put their credibility behind Israel, and then Israel dithered and did nothing and lost both itself and the US status on account of this fiasco.

He is like both Kerry and Carter in that he kowtows to the "international community." Kerry called it "the global test."

Also like both in that he is weak and indecisive and projects same to our enemies.

Also - like Kerry and Carter - has no charisma. At least Clinton has charisma. I think Clinton was more decisive than these other guys, just made some wrong decisions.

I wasn't criticizing the Admin, I was agreeing with them, and you. I am sick over Olmert's decisions.

Still I'm wondering if that US Administration support - as well as the far less usual British support had a hefty price tag attached to it. And,if it did, was the price tag the fact that Olmert was going to implement the convergence plan in record time after the end of the Lebanon campaign?

"His nephew, an IDF soldier, thinks that Olmert's picture will be listed in the dictionary besides the word "coward"."

If you read the link it is clear that Podhoretz is talking about his nephew, not Olmert's.

"was the price tag the fact that Olmert was going to implement the convergence plan in record time after the end of the Lebanon campaign"

I don't think Olmert is going to implement anything. I think he could not get a resolution wishing Israelis a Happy New Year through the Knesset.

Yeah, Robert, that is what I meant, Podhoretz' nephew, not Olmert's. I just corrected it for clarity.

Is it just me who reads the UN resolution as disarming Hizbollah by UNIFIL and Lebanese army while in the meantime the IDF can stay in Lebanon and defend itself if necessary. ???

If this goes through Hizbollah is finished as a state within the state and a significant military threat to both the Lebanese and the Israelis. Siniora and Olmert will have the political victory of signing a peace agreement between the two states.

If this doesn't go through Hizbollah will continue bulling Israel and Lebanon and probably the more agile UNIFIL. That in turn will result of the continuation of this war.

The UN is basically on Israel's side by demanding the disarming of Hisbollah. This is definitely a wining, even if not the war but at least a battle for Israel.

Rob

Rob, I've seen that interpretation. My caveats:
- the resolution addresses Hezbollah directly as an actor equal to the two states. Not a good precedent.
- UNIFIL is inept at best and owned by Hezbollah at worst.
- Lebanese army - ditto.
- demanding the disarming of Hezbollah is worth the paper it's written on.

But it could be good.

Olmert's govt. will definitely fall, ASAP. Whoever comes into office will know he is charged to restore military and civilian morale, be ready to go back into Lebanon as necessary, and to put West Bank pullout on ice.

Maybe there will be another opportunity to do this right.

The wikipedia entry for Benjamin Netanyahu now says the following:

After the mishandling of the current conflict against Hezbollah by Prime Minister Olmert, it is widely anticipated that a no-confidence vote will lead to new elections with Netanyahu becoming the next Prime Minister of Israel.

. . . . and we all know how reliable Wikipedia is . .. . .

seriously, EVERYONE expects Bibi to come back. He probaby will.

But I am curious who the other candidates are.

I think that the situation for Israel has gone from bad to worse and the future is very ominous. I would place no trust in UNIFIL if I wereIsrael. At some point this (Lebanon) will all be repeated.

"I myself feel that the destruction Israel wrought on Lebanon is less morally defensible for serving so little purpose. Since that damage was not in service of some useful end, like destroying Hezbollah, or destroying Hezbollah more than it did, if there is no useful, strategic, moral point to it, than it is harder to see the point of it at all."

Exactly. That's why Israel is guilty of WAR CRIMES!

Sorry Zombies... I just had to say it...

Remember,

You are the Zombie idiot if you don't realise that the HB's want you dead as well, you idiot!

When the detonating Muslims get you, no one will cry. You will have then earned the Darwin Award.

Detonating Muslims getting me?

I like to think some people will mourn my death.

;)

I am only arguing that there is a huge double standard in the mainstream media (NN, FoxNews, CBS, NBC, ABC).

They all call Hezbollah Terrorists, which they obviously are, but they don't call Israel a Terrorist State, which it obviously is.

That's all. I just want people to start admiting that Israel is a terrorist state.

Would you like to debate this point?

I warn you though... I will be using the UN convention, which Pro-Israeli Zombies don't like to hear, because it's so obvious Israel is violating it daily.

Reading, " who was noting that there is intense anger toward Israel within the administration for botching the war " makes me wonder about Faluja and the Administration's memory.
And after all is said and done Bush is so angered by Israel that he has let pass a UN Cease Fire Resolution, that Rice had denounced weeks before as unacceptable because it reverts to the status quo, and so botches the peace and his claim of supporting the fledgling democracy in Lebanon by letting Hezbollah and acolyte of Syria President Lamoud off the hook.
Just that, destroyed credibility with regard to Bush's push for democracy.

Anyway, after reading your earlier post Olmert: Fortune's Fool and His Own
on what Ari Shavit wrote about getting rid of Olmert I was able to watch an interview of Shavit by London and Kirschenbaum, on Israel's Channel 10.
To say the least it was most heated and was followed by the news and further discussions.
What transpired was the exposing of many faults not least of which was the mess Mofaz made during his term as Minister of Defence when billions were wasted and not spent on improving the defence force technically and psychologically for a different type of war. That is what has pissed off a lot of Israelis.
It was Mofaz who got rid of Ayalon and selected Halutz.
Halutz is only capable of seeing things in terms of his Airforce and made many mistakes.
Bibi would have had to deal with the same setup.
Has he changed sufficiently after the mess he made as Prime Minister in the late 90s? He was certainly caught flat-footed with the "Tunnel" embroglio in Jerusalem and then the Maashal business in Amman.
How Sharon would have reacted to get round the failures of the short changed IDF we don't know; maybe he would have improvised, as he did in 1973 as a General in the "Yom Kippur" war, .
From what I gather it was the US that demanded that the "diplomatic process" be given priorty earlier this week when the go ahead was given to enter Lebanon in force.

It seems like back to square one when Syria's proxy will do as it pleases with the latest resolution.
The Israeli public will kick out Olmert and co., and the IDF will see changes.
But will anger by the US Administration continue to permit it cutting off its nose .........?

Always blaming Olmert.

The reason Israel can't win this war is simple:

Hezbollah are better, braver fighters.

Nuff said.

Some people can't accept that because their parents and grand-parents and the media have been feeding them this fantasy about the god like IDF wariors.

Turns out they get scared just like everyone else.

remember, it this point it's clear you are a shill for Hizballah and their friends, and trying to demoralize us. There is no evidence for your assertions, you're just swinging wildly hoping to connect.

You have no idea what war crimes are or what a terrorist is or what a strategic war is that the IDF was not allowed to fight. You just regurgitate the lines you've been fed.

But you are a good example of the public image results of fighting a half-hearted war.

I have rarely banned anyone on this blog, but I am going to ban you, because all you do is go "nyah nyah nyah" with nothing to back it up, and it's getting boring.

Fine, but before you ban me could you please answer my questions?

1. If the targets are rocket launchers why bomb countless civilian buildings?

2. What military objective was gained by bombing civilian buildings?

These are very reasonable questions to ask don't you think?

I've already answered them. That's why I am banning you. You just repeat the same crap over and over.

Good debate. Here is link Olmert from Ha'aretz

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/749484.html

"What's the point of giving them more time when they do nothing with it?"

If this is true it is slightly hypocritical. Remember Afghanistan? That got off to a slow start.

The UN is most useful as a stalling device. Remember the run up to the Iraq invasion? So why didn't the US administration use the hard lessons it it learned from that experience to stall to give Israel time?